{"id":1749,"date":"2012-10-19T19:56:53","date_gmt":"2012-10-20T00:56:53","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.rethinkinghell.com\/?p=1749"},"modified":"2020-06-30T09:24:41","modified_gmt":"2020-06-30T09:24:41","slug":"what-traditionalists-say-vs-what-the-bible-says","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/2012\/10\/19\/what-traditionalists-say-vs-what-the-bible-says\/","title":{"rendered":"What Traditionalists Say vs. What the Bible Says"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Traditionalists say a lot of things about the fate of the unsaved, about what will and will not happen to them.<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_1');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_1');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_1\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">1<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_1\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Special thanks to Ronnie of the <a href=\"http:\/\/conditionalism.net\/blog\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Consuming Fire Blog <\/a>for supplying me with many of these quotations.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_1').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_1', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script> What they say for the most part is logically necessary given traditionalism being true. But what does the Bible say in comparison?<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_2');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_2');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_2\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">2<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_2\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Except where indicated otherwise, all scripture comes from the Holy Bible, English Standard Version (ESV). Copyright 2000 by Crossway Bibles.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_2').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_2', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script> You might be surprised.<br \/>\n<!--more--><\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\">Will the unsaved live forever in hell?<\/h2>\n<p>John MacArthur said that &#8220;every human soul is immortal. No soul, no inner person in any human being, ever goes out of existence. Every human being ever born lives forever.&#8221;<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_3');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_3');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_3\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">3<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_3\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">John MacArthur (2003, August 24). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.gty.org\/resources\/sermons\/42-141\/the-answer-to-lifes-greatest-question-part-1\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The answer to life\u2019s greatest question, Part 1<\/a>.&#8221; (Sermon, Grace Community Church, Sun Valley, CA).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_3').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_3', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>World famous preacher Charles Spurgeon said, &#8220;Thou art a fallen creature, having only capacities to live here in sin, to live forever in torment.&#8221;<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_4');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_4');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_4\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">4<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_4\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Charles Spurgeon (1857, December 13). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.spurgeon.org\/sermons\/0167.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Holy Spirit and the one church<\/a>.&#8221; (Music Hall, Royal Surrey Gardens, London).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_4').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_4', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>Every traditionalist preacher who has ever lived has said at some point, &#8220;Everybody lives forever somewhere.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p><strong>But the Bible says<\/strong>:<br \/>\n&#8220;And the Lord God said, \u2018The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.\u2019 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken&#8221; (Genesis 3:22-23, NIV).<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_5');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_5');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_5\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">5<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_5\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">All scriptures taken from the Holy Bible, New International Version are Copyright \u00a9 1973, 1978, 1984 Biblica. Used by permission of Zondervan. All rights reserved. The \u201cNIV\u201d and \u201cNew International Version\u201d trademarks are registered in the United States Patent and Trademark Office by Biblica. Use of either trademark requires the permission of Biblica.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_5').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_5', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script> <span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_6');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_6');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_6\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">6<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_6\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">More literal translations make the same point clearly and unambiguously, but it is worded in a much less concise manner than that found in the NIV.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_6').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_6', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\">Will the fires of hell consume the wicked?<\/h2>\n<p>Every Protestant\u2019s favorite Roman Catholic, St. Thomas Aquinas, said, \u201cLikewise they [the wicked] shall be passible, because they shall never deteriorate and, although burning eternally in fire, they shall never be consumed.\u201d<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_7');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_7');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_7\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">7<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_7\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Thomas Aquinas (1939). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/dhspriory.org\/thomas\/Creed.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Apostles\u2019 Creed<\/a><\/em>, trans. Joseph B. Collins (New York: N.p.).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_7').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_7', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>Jonathan Edwards said, \u201cAnd here the bodies of all the wicked shall burn, and be tormented to all eternity, and never be consumed; and the wrath of God shall be poured out on their souls.\u201d<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_8');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_8');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_8\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">8<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_8\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Jonathan Edwards (1995). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/edwards\/works1.xii.vi.xiii.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The history of redemption<\/a>.&#8221; <em>Works of Jonathan Edwards,<\/em> Vol. 2 (Avon: Banner of Truth).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_8').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_8', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>Charles Spurgeon likewise said: \u201cIn fire exactly like that which we have on earth thy body will lie, asbestos-like, forever unconsumed, all thy veins roads for the feet of pain to travel on, every nerve a string on which the devil shall forever play his diabolical tune of \u2018Hell\u2019s Unutterable Lament.\u2019\u201d<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_9');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_9');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_9\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">9<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_9\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Charles Spurgeon (1856, February 7), &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.spurgeon.org\/sermons\/0066.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Resurrection of the Dead<\/a>.&#8221; (Sermon, New Park Street Chapel, Southwark, London).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_9').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_9', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p><strong>But the Bible says<\/strong>:<br \/>\n\u201cFor if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries [of God]\u201d (Hebrews 10:26-27).<\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\">Are souls immortal, or do the souls of the unsaved die?<\/h2>\n<p>John Gill says that \u201cthe soul in torment shall never die, or lose any of its powers and faculties.\u201d<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_10');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_10');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_10\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">10<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_10\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">John Gill (N.d.). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblestudytools.com\/commentaries\/gills-exposition-of-the-bible\/mark-9-49.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Marcos 9:49<\/a>.&#8221; <em>John Gill\u2019s Exposition of the Entire Bible<\/em> (N.p.).<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_10').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_10', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>John Nelson Darby said, &#8220;Furthermore, I understand an immortal soul that is at enmity with God and excluded from Him, though once formed to own Him, being for ever miserable.&#8221;<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_11');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_11');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_11\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">11<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_11\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">John Nelson Darby (N.d.). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/books.google.com\/books?id=LZIXAAAAYAAJ&amp;printsec=frontcover&amp;source=gbs_ge_summary_r&amp;cad=0#v=onepage&amp;q&amp;f=false\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">On the Eternity of Punishment and the Immortality of the Soul <\/a><\/em>(London: Robert L. Allan), 23.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_11').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_11', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>Kenneth Gentry said, &#8220;And especially is man inquisitive about the future since, even though he is endowed with an immortal soul, he is a creature enmeshed in time.&#8221;<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_12');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_12');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_12\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">12<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_12\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Kenneth Gentry (1989). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/freebooks.entrewave.com\/freebooks\/docs\/a_pdfs\/kgbj.pdf\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Before Jerusalem Fell<\/a><\/em>. (Tyler, TX: Institute for Christian Economics), 5.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_12').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_12', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p><strong>But the Bible says<\/strong>:<br \/>\n&#8220;Let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins&#8221; (James 5:20).<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;To those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life, but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth &#8230;&#8221; (Romans 2:7-8a). (Why seek for what you already have?)<\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\">Will the unsaved be destroyed?<\/h2>\n<p>Apologist Jim Wallace said, \u201cThey [the unsaved] will not be destroyed, but instead, will be left in a conscious state to experience the torment and anguish of their punishment forever.\u201d<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_13');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_13');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_13\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">13<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_13\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Jim Wallace (2012, October 19). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.pleaseconvinceme.com\/index\/Is_There_an_Eternal_Conscious_Hell\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Is there an eternal conscious hell<\/a>?&#8221; <em>PleaseConvinceMe.com<\/em>.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_13').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_13', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p>Don Stewart said, &#8220;It is not possible for the soul, or spirit, to be destroyed.&#8221;<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_14');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_14');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_14\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">14<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_14\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Don Stewart, &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.blueletterbible.org\/faq\/don_stewart\/stewart.cfm?id=102\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Can the spirit, or soul, be destroyed<\/a>?&#8221; Blue Letter Bible.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_14').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_14', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script><\/p>\n<p><strong>But the Bible says<\/strong>:<br \/>\n&#8220;And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell&#8221; (Matthew 10:28).<br \/>\n&#8220;But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly&#8221; (2 Peter 3:7).<br \/>\nThat all seems pretty clear, doesn&#8217;t it?<\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\">Conclusi\u00f3n<\/h2>\n<p>Obviously this isn&#8217;t the end-all and be-all of the discussion. We annihilationists have a few difficult passages that suggest eternal torment which we must explain. (And we have.)<span class=\"footnote_referrer\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_15');\" onkeypress=\"footnote_moveToReference_1749_1('footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_15');\" ><sup id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_15\" class=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text\">15<\/sup><\/a><span id=\"footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_15\" class=\"footnote_tooltip\">Free resources that address some of those passages include fellow contributor Glenn People&#8217;s podcast episodes <a href=\"http:\/\/www.beretta-online.com\/wordpress\/2008\/episode-006-hell-part-2-tradition-strikes-back\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">6<\/a> and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.beretta-online.com\/wordpress\/2008\/episode-007-the-hell-series-crashes-and-burns-finally\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">7<\/a>, as well as Rethinking Hell podcast episode <a href=\"http:\/\/www.rethinkinghell.com\/2012\/10\/episode-7-traditional-objections-answered-with-chris-date\/\">7<\/a>. I also wrote a bit of a treatise on the topic called <em><a href=\"http:\/\/3-ringbinder.weebly.com\/uploads\/1\/9\/1\/0\/1910989\/the_bible_teaches_annihilationism.pdf\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Bible Teaches Annihilationism<\/a><\/em> that might be of use to you if you want to look into this more.<\/span><\/span><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> jQuery('#footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_15').tooltip({ tip: '#footnote_plugin_tooltip_text_1749_1_15', tipClass: 'footnote_tooltip', effect: 'fade', predelay: 0, fadeInSpeed: 200, delay: 400, fadeOutSpeed: 200, position: 'top right', relative: true, offset: [10, 10], });<\/script> And as I said before, not everything can be taken at <a href=\"http:\/\/www.rethinkinghell.com\/2012\/08\/traditionalism-and-annihilationism-in-light-of-the-face-value-meaning-of-scripture\">face value<\/a>. Traditionalists do have arguments for why consume doesn&#8217;t mean consume as we would normally mean it, why live and die don&#8217;t mean live and die as we would normally mean them, why destroy doesn&#8217;t mean destroy as we would normally mean it, why immortality doesn&#8217;t mean immortality as we would normally mean it&#8230;and so on.<br \/>\nPerhaps you can see why people are starting to rethink hell: They are simply looking at what the Bible says about it.<\/p>\n<div class=\"speaker-mute footnotes_reference_container\"> <div class=\"footnote_container_prepare\"><p><span role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_reference_container_label pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_expand_collapse_reference_container_1749_1();\">&#x202F;<\/span><span role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_reference_container_collapse_button\" style=\"display: none;\" onclick=\"footnote_expand_collapse_reference_container_1749_1();\">[<a id=\"footnote_reference_container_collapse_button_1749_1\">+<\/a>]<\/span><\/p><\/div> <div id=\"footnote_references_container_1749_1\" style=\"\"><table class=\"footnotes_table footnote-reference-container\"><caption class=\"accessibility\">References<\/caption> <tbody> \r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_1\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_1');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>1<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Special thanks to Ronnie of the <a href=\"http:\/\/conditionalism.net\/blog\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Consuming Fire Blog <\/a>for supplying me with many of these quotations.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_2\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_2');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>2<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Except where indicated otherwise, all scripture comes from the Holy Bible, English Standard Version (ESV). Copyright 2000 by Crossway Bibles.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_3\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_3');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>3<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">John MacArthur (2003, August 24). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.gty.org\/resources\/sermons\/42-141\/the-answer-to-lifes-greatest-question-part-1\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The answer to life\u2019s greatest question, Part 1<\/a>.&#8221; (Sermon, Grace Community Church, Sun Valley, CA).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_4\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_4');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>4<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Charles Spurgeon (1857, December 13). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.spurgeon.org\/sermons\/0167.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Holy Spirit and the one church<\/a>.&#8221; (Music Hall, Royal Surrey Gardens, London).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_5\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_5');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>5<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">All scriptures taken from the Holy Bible, New International Version are Copyright \u00a9 1973, 1978, 1984 Biblica. Used by permission of Zondervan. All rights reserved. The \u201cNIV\u201d and \u201cNew International Version\u201d trademarks are registered in the United States Patent and Trademark Office by Biblica. Use of either trademark requires the permission of Biblica.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_6\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_6');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>6<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">More literal translations make the same point clearly and unambiguously, but it is worded in a much less concise manner than that found in the NIV.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_7\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_7');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>7<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Thomas Aquinas (1939). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/dhspriory.org\/thomas\/Creed.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Apostles\u2019 Creed<\/a><\/em>, trans. Joseph B. Collins (New York: N.p.).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_8\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_8');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>8<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Jonathan Edwards (1995). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/edwards\/works1.xii.vi.xiii.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The history of redemption<\/a>.&#8221; <em>Works of Jonathan Edwards,<\/em> Vol. 2 (Avon: Banner of Truth).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_9\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_9');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>9<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Charles Spurgeon (1856, February 7), &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.spurgeon.org\/sermons\/0066.htm\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Resurrection of the Dead<\/a>.&#8221; (Sermon, New Park Street Chapel, Southwark, London).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_10\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_10');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>10<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">John Gill (N.d.). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.biblestudytools.com\/commentaries\/gills-exposition-of-the-bible\/mark-9-49.html\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Marcos 9:49<\/a>.&#8221; <em>John Gill\u2019s Exposition of the Entire Bible<\/em> (N.p.).<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_11\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_11');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>11<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">John Nelson Darby (N.d.). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/books.google.com\/books?id=LZIXAAAAYAAJ&amp;printsec=frontcover&amp;source=gbs_ge_summary_r&amp;cad=0#v=onepage&amp;q&amp;f=false\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">On the Eternity of Punishment and the Immortality of the Soul <\/a><\/em>(London: Robert L. Allan), 23.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_12\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_12');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>12<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Kenneth Gentry (1989). <em><a href=\"http:\/\/freebooks.entrewave.com\/freebooks\/docs\/a_pdfs\/kgbj.pdf\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Before Jerusalem Fell<\/a><\/em>. (Tyler, TX: Institute for Christian Economics), 5.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_13\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_13');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>13<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Jim Wallace (2012, October 19). &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.pleaseconvinceme.com\/index\/Is_There_an_Eternal_Conscious_Hell\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Is there an eternal conscious hell<\/a>?&#8221; <em>PleaseConvinceMe.com<\/em>.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_14\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_14');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>14<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Don Stewart, &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.blueletterbible.org\/faq\/don_stewart\/stewart.cfm?id=102\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">Can the spirit, or soul, be destroyed<\/a>?&#8221; Blue Letter Bible.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n<tr class=\"footnotes_plugin_reference_row\"> <th scope=\"row\" id=\"footnote_plugin_reference_1749_1_15\" class=\"footnote_plugin_index pointer\" onclick=\"footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1('footnote_plugin_tooltip_1749_1_15');\"><a role=\"button\" tabindex=\"0\" class=\"footnote_plugin_link\" ><span class=\"footnote_index_arrow\">&#65514;<\/span>15<\/a><\/th> <td class=\"footnote_plugin_text\">Free resources that address some of those passages include fellow contributor Glenn People&#8217;s podcast episodes <a href=\"http:\/\/www.beretta-online.com\/wordpress\/2008\/episode-006-hell-part-2-tradition-strikes-back\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">6<\/a> and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.beretta-online.com\/wordpress\/2008\/episode-007-the-hell-series-crashes-and-burns-finally\/\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">7<\/a>, as well as Rethinking Hell podcast episode <a href=\"http:\/\/www.rethinkinghell.com\/2012\/10\/episode-7-traditional-objections-answered-with-chris-date\/\">7<\/a>. I also wrote a bit of a treatise on the topic called <em><a href=\"http:\/\/3-ringbinder.weebly.com\/uploads\/1\/9\/1\/0\/1910989\/the_bible_teaches_annihilationism.pdf\" rel=\"nofollow noopener\" target=\"_blank\">The Bible Teaches Annihilationism<\/a><\/em> that might be of use to you if you want to look into this more.<\/td><\/tr>\r\n\r\n <\/tbody> <\/table> <\/div><\/div><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> function footnote_expand_reference_container_1749_1() { jQuery('#footnote_references_container_1749_1').show(); jQuery('#footnote_reference_container_collapse_button_1749_1').text('\u2212'); } function footnote_collapse_reference_container_1749_1() { jQuery('#footnote_references_container_1749_1').hide(); jQuery('#footnote_reference_container_collapse_button_1749_1').text('+'); } function footnote_expand_collapse_reference_container_1749_1() { if (jQuery('#footnote_references_container_1749_1').is(':hidden')) { footnote_expand_reference_container_1749_1(); } else { footnote_collapse_reference_container_1749_1(); } } function footnote_moveToReference_1749_1(p_str_TargetID) { footnote_expand_reference_container_1749_1(); var l_obj_Target = jQuery('#' + p_str_TargetID); if (l_obj_Target.length) { jQuery( 'html, body' ).delay( 0 ); jQuery('html, body').animate({ scrollTop: l_obj_Target.offset().top - window.innerHeight * 0.2 }, 380); } } function footnote_moveToAnchor_1749_1(p_str_TargetID) { footnote_expand_reference_container_1749_1(); var l_obj_Target = jQuery('#' + p_str_TargetID); if (l_obj_Target.length) { jQuery( 'html, body' ).delay( 0 ); jQuery('html, body').animate({ scrollTop: l_obj_Target.offset().top - window.innerHeight * 0.2 }, 380); } }<\/script>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Traditionalists say a lot of things about the fate of the unsaved, about what will and will not happen to them.1Special thanks to Ronnie of the Consuming Fire Blog for supplying me with many of these quotations. What they say for the most part is logically necessary given traditionalism being true. But what does the &hellip; <a href=\"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/2012\/10\/19\/what-traditionalists-say-vs-what-the-bible-says\/\" class=\"more-link\">Continue reading <span class=\"screen-reader-text\">What Traditionalists Say vs. What the Bible Says<\/span><\/a><\/p>","protected":false},"author":6,"featured_media":20922,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[5,12],"tags":[],"coauthors":[962],"class_list":["post-1749","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-biblical-exegesis","category-criticisms"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1749","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/6"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=1749"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1749\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/20922"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=1749"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=1749"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=1749"},{"taxonomy":"author","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/rethinkinghell.com\/es\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/coauthors?post=1749"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}